Hey there and welcome to the BigAppleSchool podcast. My name is Sam.
And today we’re asking what’s the craic about Fox vs Disney films.
So we’re gonna look at some of the most recent and past Disney films and Marvel films from 20 century Fox and Disney Marvel. Give our opinion on them, what we think of them, what we like, don’t like.
Whether one studio is more successful than the other – you will have your opinion on that. A little bit about X-men specifics cause Ryno’s a lover of X men, aren’t you?
I couldn’t say I’m passionate about it, but I’ve watched them more than I have Avengers.
Okay, fair enough. And I watch both, actually, and enjoy both, in a varying degree. And we’re gonna look about the newer films as well and ask questions about those. And who we would like to settle down superhero-wise?
In the beginning… we’ll come to that. So, Ryno?
Don’t be afraid, you can give an honest answer. Ryno, do you know who makes the X-men films, Deadpool…
I’m still confused who makes which film or movie as I prefer to say, so you’ll talk about films, I will talk about movies, although it’s the same thing. I still don’t know.
X-men, Deadpool, Fantastic Four, and even the older Spiderman films. And someone’s gonna correct me if I’m wrong – they are made, they’re produced by 20th century Fox.
Or were? I’ll come to that surprise later.
Have you heard anything about that?
No? I just ran onto that recently. Well, not so recent, but it’s fairly recent. Well, let’s… We’re on that topic….
Disney buy everything, right? They bought Star Wars, they bought…. I mean they bought the Avengers, they didn’t originally have the Marvel studios, they bought Marvel studios. They bought Star Wars. And now most recently I found out – in March this year they bought 20th century Fox films, so..
Yeah, so the most… As I understand, the most recent X-men film is not produced by Disney, but…
Which is the ‘Dark Phoenix’?
Exactly. And ‘The New Mutants’ or whatever it’s called – it’s another… it’s gonna be kinda like an X-men film, maybe more like a horror. It’s gonna be from 20th century Fox studio too, but from now on I guess there’re gonna be a change in that.
Maybe for the better, maybe not. So, who… you might know the answer to this one – who makes Marvel Avengers films?
Yeah! So it’s Disney Marvel and, as I understand... Not being an expert, but I understand that… I’ve heard a little bit on the grapevine, bits and pieces, watching reviewers on YouTube.
And as I understand Disney controls this and they own Marvel studios, and so Marvel studios makes the Avengers. And they’re very much separate, or they were. But now, I guess, there’s a possibility I’m assuming, there’s a possibility to see Wolverine and Captain America fight or something.
That’ll be a bit of a cross mix of Avengers, Marvel’s, X-men Avengers avenging X-men. Something like that. Maybe.
They could do a lot of things here, I guess. And maybe that’s necessary - breeze some freshness into it.
Maybe I would stop watching it.
I think it becomes too messy to get the stories in alignment. It’s messy, really.
Do you think there’s a different tone between the different X-men and Avengers?
For me and for some of the people I’ve spoken with, actually some of my students, Avengers has more youthlike approach, more teenage fan base.
The X-men I think is a little bit more grown-up.
You would’ve agreed with me? Okay.
Yeah, it’s a little bit more… I mean, it’s still grown people acting as superheroes, you knowing, doing…
…unimaginable and impossible stuff, but I think themes and… it’s very cerebral, right?
Cerebral? Cerebral? Yeah yeah.
So who do you prefer? I think I know the answer.
I think you know the answer.
Maybe listeners know the answer, but I’m gonna ask it. Do you prefer the X-men and other Fox films like Deadpool, Fantastic Four… maybe not Fantastic Four… Or do you prefer the Disney Marvel films like Avengers and…?
Well, there’s a bit of a problem, because I really enjoyed Deadpool, I really enjoyed Deadpool, but he’s more of an antihero.
Okay. And Fantastic Four – I liked the.. I think it’s the 2005 version…
And do you know who was the.. what’s the character that goes on fire? Do you know who that was?
Do you know who that actor was?
That’s the same guy that plays Captain America.
No! Chris Hemsworth? Chris Evans!
Chris Evans played in Fantastic Four, yeah.
I mean, that was before… that stopped before he became Captain America.
So yeah, that was one of his…
I enjoyed the… I only watched the Fantastic Four and ‘Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer’.
And those two actually I quite enjoyed. But if you ask me about Avengers versus X-men movies, I will choose the X-men movies all the time.
Well.. I cannot say because they make more sense, because the timeline in the X-men movies makes no sense, whether you watch it chronologically or you watch according to release date. Actually, the X-men movies – there were so many continuity errors.
But I think I prefer the characters. I think I prefer the connections – it’s a little bit more serious, if I think…
You feel more educated when you watch them?
I don’t think this qualifies as educated entertainment, or educational entertainment. But when I watch Avengers I often get a little bit bored.
Okay. Not enough depth in the plot, you mean?
I like the character Ironman – I must admit that I enjoy the Ironman. And the Ironman 2 – I enjoyed it very much, maybe because of the actor.
Yeah, he’s a fantastic guy.
Very long answer, actually, for a very short question, I’m sorry.
What is your favorite film from those? I guess it’s an X-men film, right?
I mean, and I’m talking about Marvel films and superheroes. What’s your favorite film? Excluding DC at the moment.
Even that is confusing to me, DC versus Marvel, because I’m not such a fanatic.
So for me I’ve landed myself into serious trouble, having discussions with people and they said ‘Oh that’s not DC, that’s Marvel!’. So I’m having a trouble…
So, X-men I would say the first ones.
…with… oh I forgot the actor’s name, the bold guy… Patrick Stewart!
Oh Patrick Stewart! Right.
Patrick Stewart. I prefer him as Xavier.
Yeah. Yes, with the Wolverines and…
You don’t like the younger guy… James McAvoy?
James McAvoy… Nooo… James McAvoy is a fantastic actor.
I do not enjoy how he plays Xavier because he is very uncontrolled… out of control at times, cause emotions are all over the place, his reactions are all over the place, and Patrick Stewart is very composed, very calm, very measured in his approaches to things.
Yes, absolutely so! I cannot, as I struggle very much with picturing James McAvoy as Xavier becoming Patrick Stewart’s Xavier.
Maybe its fault is because it’s been written…
A character that needs development to become that Patrick Stewart guy…
I’m hoping that someday they will do that.
In the 2000s there were three X-men films, and the third one is generally treated as, you know, disappointing let’s say. Do you like it? It’s got the Jean Grey going mental and killing a lot of people.
I actually did… I didn’t necessarily like the story because it’s dark. When you saw the superheroes, you wanted to be.. saved the world.
She kills, yes, and she becomes…
But I actually think it was quite a powerful film. I…
You can you like it if you want.
Again, I said to you, I don’t know if I liked it… But ‘like’ for me is a strange word, so I liked the fact that there was darkness in the story.
I liked it. That shouldn’t be strange to you.
It was dark which is good, because it brings a bit of reality check to people, you know, life isn’t a superhero movie.
So, actually the three together I do enjoy it, yes. I would struggle to choose one of the three, I would choose them as a package.
Okay. Fair enough. If you were to ask me, okay… So, Fox or Disney, honestly, I like both – I agree with you that the X-men films are more grown-up and… at least in tone anyway, in their cerebral nature.
And… I really quite like ‘Days of Future Past’ – I think it’s the second of them more modern ones. A second one? Where they time-travel and Wolverine…
Highly confusing. I think I liked it most because it was science fiction, like showing the future, and these machines they.. What are they called, those machines?
Ah, those things that could smell the mutants and kill them?
But regardless, those machines there and in the future, and the time-travelling aspect. Cause I’m a lover of science fiction.
Almost like Terminators, but they weren’t called Terminators, so... it was something like that.
Yeah. And I remember actually maybe partly because I remembered those from other things that I’ve watched. And they kinda… I watched the cartoon when I was a boy – have you ever seen the cartoons?
In the 90s they made these X-Men cartoons – Wolverine was in a colorful blue and yellow suit, and the mask on or something around his head at least. And all the X-men were, you know, in all their colorful suits and so on. But they were really well-written. And good cartoons…
I know why I didn’t watch them.
I was already working. That’s why I didn’t watch them.
Fair enough, fair enough. They made five seasons of them and I know nothing about, as far as whether they were true to the comics or not, but stories were great. And they actually did the ‘Dark Phoenix’ story, which is…
They did that. Which is showing now, and which is also the story that… the film that you not sure if you like, the third of the older X-Men films they also did… tried to do the Dark Phoenix.
It’s sort of Jean turning dark…
Jean gets possessed by a cosmic…
Don’t spoil the movie because I’m going to see it tomorrow.
No, no, I haven’t seen the film.
Jean gets possessed by like a cosmic force, which is a Phoenix, and it’s more power than she can control.
And that’s basically it. I don’t remember, but the cartoon seemed to do it better than anything to be honest.
It would be very interesting to understand where that fits in on the very peculiar X-men timeline.
Okay. What is your favorite X-man and why?
I think my favorite X-woman…
I like her abilities, I like the ability of controlling the elements.
It’s in my opinion stronger than any of the others. I don’t care how many times Wolverine can regenerate and… if you can control the water, the air, the clouds, the volcanoes – that is pretty powerful and how well she controls things... it’s….
She’s quite grown-up as well.
Very… Here we go again! Maybe it’s my age! This is the problem.
You’re only 30, aren’t you?
VAT. And who is your favorite Avenger if you have one of those?
Because of Robert Downey Junior?
Because of Robert Downey Junior.
His sense of humor, the way he portrays the character, it is… I really enjoy it, because it’s.. it’s not quite an antihero, it’s not like Deadpool, it’s not as seriously antihero as Deadpool is…
But there’s enough of a bite in his character, that makes you think ‘actually I don’t like you at the moment’. But in a couple of minutes he saves the world again, and…
Do you know who his assistant is?
Pepper… what’s her second name?
Oy… I know her real name is Gwyneth Paltrow, but I don’t know…
Her second name is Potts.
Just like me! Just like me! I’m not sure that’s…
It’s not the actor’s, it’s the character’s, and Pepper Potts sounds a bit weird, doesn’t it?
Pepper Potts. Like salt and pepper pots.
Pepper Potts. I, yeah, I also… I think… you know, as regards to Ironman and Robert Downey Junior, I think that he is the main reason why Marvel got popular. Cause, I mean…
Until that first Ironman film in 2008 they didn’t really… They were still finding their feet before that. I mean they made some fairly good films, but…
What was it like before that? Give me one or two names of the movies before that.
I think Hulk? I’m sure Hulk.
Ah, yes yes yes, it was before that.
And I think maybe both of them were before that. I’m not 100% sure.
I think Thor was before that.
I agree with you, I think that popularity increased tremendously because of his acting there.
Whether it was him as an actor, I think it probably was, to be honest. Yeah. The Ironman films are great. Well…
Wait wait wait wait. Your characters?
Right. My favorite X-man is Wolverine, because he’s dark. Because he’s… he’s a kinda tough dude, but you know, he only suffers. I guess I’m attracted to that, to that kind of character.
Pain in the world. I like suffering.
I like my superheroes to suffer.
It can’t be easy for them.
I like X-men, I like Wolverine, I like Deadpool… oh not Deadpool, I like Daredevil.
Not the film, I mean the tv show, which is very good.
And it’s very dark and adult and you would like it actually, I think. My favorite Avenger… I like the Hulk.
He also suffers. It’s difficult for him.
Yeah but I think I like the Hulk mostly because I read a comic, and it’s a very popular, classic I suppose as far as comics go. Not in literature, but in comics. It’s called ‘Planet Hulk’ and it was fantastic from he perspective that they put him in another world. And they could do pretty much what they wanted.
And that was great. And he fights all kinds of creatures, and actually becomes like the king of this world. And then he comes back to beat the crap out of the Avengers. Because they sent him there. A spoiler alert if you wanna read those comics. But it’s very good.
The spoiler alert was very late by the way.
I have to hang back to that spoiler alert. Who is your least favorite X-man and why?
Again, I’m going to go for a woman, X-woman. Well she’s not really a part of the X-force, but she’s in the X-movies. It’s Mystique. Because she is just too confused about who she is.
Then I’m good, then I’m bad, then I’m blue, then I’m not.
Maybe it’s the writers that did that, but yeah, I get what you mean.
She’s… Magneto’s also confused, Magneto also struggles with…
I wanna be good or I wanna be bad.
He was always kinda bad though.
But he’s a little bit more consistent, and he is maybe…. Maybe the character is a little bit better at expressing the darkness. When he goes dark, he goes really dark, he doesn’t stop halfway. 00:19:00 R: Mystique.. I don’t know… She… sometimes she’s convinced not to… I don’t know. She sometimes irritates me a little bit, I think. Maybe the bigger problem is I think sometimes she irritates me a little bit.
Maybe the continuity between films is the problem as well…
Cause I think in the newer films she would like switch side and they were more modern. The first one… and that irritate me a bit too actually. Cause she should’ve been, as far as I was concerned, and until that point she was good…
And then she suddenly pop! Changed! Who was my least favorite character?
I’m waiting. I’m waiting. We’re talking about the blue lady, but…
I… It’s a tough one, actually. I mean, I think I don’t like the character… what’s his name? with cards… With the poker cards… What’s his name? He’s not really in those.
But the fact that he was in the…
He can charge anything he touches and throw it, I cannot remember his name… But he is very good in the cartoons. But he was in the film played by Taylor Kitsch, I think in one of the films. Just like a very short cameo for the character.
And I didn’t… I just didn’t like that scene, I suppose, was the issue. But the actual character is okay, but just in that scene in that film it didn’t work. I didn’t like it. I’m gonna wake up at two o’clock in the morning and think ‘that’s the name of that guy!’ Someone will write this below for us, won’t they?
Their life depends on it. My least favorite Avenger… Oh did I ask you who…?
No. But you go first this time, I’d like to...
My least favorite Avenger… Honestly, I’m not a fan of Black Widow. I don’t think she belongs… Not because of her gender, but she doesn’t have a lot to bring with superheroes, she’s not a superhero.
And, I mean, I guess… I mean, she does a lot of shooting, and backflips, and acrobatics, but that’s it. That’s not a superhero. And so I… It’s not that I dislike her, but I think she’s out of place there. What about you?
Oi… The least favorite… Are we including things like Guardians of the Galaxy? Cause they all actually become part of the Avengers.
They’re now in the Avengers films, so I’ll give you that.
Actually, if we have to look at just the Avengers… Maybe Hulk.
You’re worried because I said that that was my favorite.
Why do you think so? You won’t offend me.
I’m not a big fan of Hulk. Strange enough, I like his… the movie about Hulk only – I enjoyed it.
One or two? Which one are you talking about?
Hang on… There wasn’t a stand-alone with the current actor.
There was an old… 2004 or 2008 or 2007? There were two, but the current actor they never did a stand-alone, if I’m correct.
I’m not a big fan of Hulk, I’m really not a big fan of Hulk, and then the Spiderman’s I don’t enjoy them. I have… I never watch the stand-alone movies, I don’t enjoy, and particularly not enjoy, Avengers, especially not towards the end with this young guy who is acting…
Yeah. Tobey Maguire was good.
I can say that Tobey Maguire’s Spiderman was good.
I do think he was good, although, I mean, maybe, I’ve watched them too often… I think, a lot of people say that the third one was terrible… I didn’t think it was terrible – I enjoyed it, but it was a bit cluttered.
The newer one, the ones that came… I mean, there have been so many. I think the problem for me, and I do have a problem with Spiderman a little bit, is that there are too many now.
And they make them so often.
In Avengers now he is very immature.
Mister Stark! Mister Stark! That irritates me.
That is more like Spiderman to be honest, because the other… I mean he’s supposed to be in school.
From the TV, from the comics, and the cartoons – he’s supposed to be in school. So, that’s probably more true to the comics and stuff. But maybe, yeah, maybe they can’t keep him in school , but have him a little bit more grown up.
His actions are very very childlike for me. And I think that’s what bothers me the most.
You don’t like children, Ryno?
What are the better films? So you’ve got the 20th century Fox, X-men stuff, and Deadpool, and well we’ll not speak of the Fantastic Four, we’ll put that away…
You don’t even know why you mention that I prefer them.
Compared to the Avengers, yeah? And you kinda said why…
Yeah I like a little bit more continuity in the characters, a little bit more depth to the characters.
But I’m gonna fight you here.
Because in, I think, you can agree with me that generally speaking the Avengers are more popular.
Absolutely, I would agree with that.
People are going to the cinema to watch those films and they’re excited about them. And when it comes to the X-men, they’re like ‘mmm maybe I’ll watch that, maybe maybe’.
I agree with you, I think it almost is.. I’m sure it’s not true, but it’s almost like the Avengers are bigger budget movies. The special effects are better, the CGI is better, explosions are bigger, … are faster.
Maybe because it’s more popular – they can afford to do that.
Yes, I think that is maybe.
Or maybe because it is owned by Disney.
Well there’s a lot of money to do what exactly they…
Mickey Mouse is not poor.
Absolutely. Mickey Mouse is also how many years old? Hundreds and hundreds and something.
It’s older than both of us. So, I completely agree with you about popularity, but that doesn’t mean their films are better.
But for you the X-men are more cerebral, more grown-up.
I’m thinking a bit more history line and history.
Incredibly confusing, I do agree with that. I’ve already said – I sometimes think that one of the reviews I read said ‘you need to take some serous brain adjusters and antidepressants or something to understand the timeline”, because even then…
I have really watched them in release order, I’ve watched them in chronological order, and they are.. You cannot really make knots! It’s that confusing sometimes in consistency and things.
I, I mean, these 2001s and the younger ones more modern – I considered are a reboot. Don’t…. Wouldn’t you agree that they’re not supposed to be connected? Maybe…
It’s almost like they are redeveloping them.
You know, like, there are going to be remake of an old X-men movies we see now – more with the current characters and portrayal of the
Different actors for the most part. I suppose maybe that’s what makes it confusing too, cause they kept some of the old characters, didn’t they? At least Patrick Stewart and…
No, no… Well, yes, but the guy… Oh, what’s his name? You’re gonna kill me… Gandalf? What’s his name? I should know his name!
Ian McKellen! Fantastic guy!
Sir Ian McKellen, isn’t it?
Sir Ian McKellen, that’s correct. You have to salute him or whatever. He is fantastic…
But he is just a fantastic actor.
I mean, he is fantastic, and Patrick Stewart is also amazing.
But he’s fantastic as well.
Absolutely. And fantastic there as well. I would also argue that critically, I mean, I’m gonna argue for Avengers that critically they’re better guarded. I mean, they’ve hardly made a mistake, as far as critics are concerned, except for maybe…
You’re talking about continuity and timelines and they way their stories should match are interesting.
Built up over how many years? Over more than 10 years? To get to the final Avengers films.
I really enjoyed the Avengers films, the Ironmans et cetera. I haven’t watched many – I call them side movies, you know, the stand-alone Black Panther movie, the stand-alone… So I haven’t watched many of those.
Some of them are really worth watching.
Captain Marvel I did watch, and that was actually very good.
I think what bothered me – I have not seen Avengers Endgame, because unfortunately it wasn’t shown in English, so I have to wait for the English version, but I saw ‘Infinity war’, the previous one.
I haven’t seen Endgame either, I have to confess.
Maybe we should stop the podcast now.
We should. We should find the English version, that’s all. But in the Infinity War movie I was very irritated.
There were too many superheroes.
Maybe too much going on, but…
Do you think it was because you weren’t watching the side films?
And you were like ‘who the heck is that?’
Who are you? Why are you?
Let’s pause it, ask someone on the cinema ‘Excuse me?’
No, that really is what happened! I went to see it with a couple of friends…
They were irritated with me. I was like ‘Who is that? Who is that?’ And they eventually said ‘shut up! You should watch the movies!’
So I found that very irritating.
Well that for once would be a plus cause they’d be saying ‘you need to watch the other films’…
Yeah I haven’t seen it either because I think my wife was off with the 3-hour length…
Cause it’s quite long. As far as Infinity War…
I watched it in the cinema…
Exactly! That was three hours.
With my parents… Well, I mean, yeah, my wife… I mean it was mostly my wife wasn’t keen on sitting for three hours and…
I wouldn’t call them, you know… But I will watch it, we will watch it later. It’s just not an immediate concern for me.
It is much more comfortable to watch it at home for me. I still prefer sometimes sitting at home on the couch with…
a glass of whatever you want.
The cinema’s okay, but yeah, I think, at home is much more comfortable, simple. The Dark Phoenix film, then – you haven’t…?
You also haven’t seen it?
But I’m gonna see this and I’m gonna say this and I’m gonna spoil it. You’re still gonna go tomorrow, right? No matter what I say?
No, I’m not gonna say a spoiler, I’m just gonna say that I have listened to a couple of reviewers, and they have not liked it.
Yeah, I’ve also read that… they said…
It’s not got a good review, it’s not critically appraised. Whereas I would argue that Avengers Endgame has been… So success-wise, I mean, as far as the critics go…
Avengers. And as for me personally, what I would like to watch – I like both. You prefer…
I selectively like the Avengers? Yeah?
Well, I guess, we could… If we were to conclude it, we could say that the Avengers are critically successful by far.
But if you’re willing to put up with some ... and you wanna more cerebral feeling, you can watch the X-men. And I like the style of them, I mean, they are much more stylized, especially more modern ones.
They’ve got that going for… So, in conclusion, which two superheroes would you like to see settle down and have a family? Little superhero children?
So, I have two answers here for you. I though about this and I thought maybe Magneto and Mystique, because they can call their children M&Ms. So…
That’s a good idea. Seriously? Peanut M&M?
One could be Peanut, one could be chocolate and one could be raisin M&Ms. Seriously, it’s time for Tony Stark to marry Pepper Potts. It’s really time….
Exactly. Exactly. And your…? What do you think?
So, I would never marry off Batman, although him and Catwoman are always, you know, romantic undertones, but you can’t have Batman married. So, I’m going for Wolverine, cause he’s suffered enough, even though I like him suffering.
I though you like the suffering, you want him…
But I like to see him married, and I think he has been…
He has been married in his.. In the movies… Well not married, but very settled with..
Right. But especially in the cartoon… I think in the earlier films too he was really into Jean Grey...
Yes, they were very connected.
And I’d like them to marry…
Uh? The actress you mean?
Nonono, but she’s dead. She dies in the third one.
Yeah, but Dark Phoenix, you haven’t seen it yet…
Yeah, but it won’t be the same actress. That actress was phenomenal in the first X-men movies.
Yeah, I’m not even gonna try to pronounce her name. But… But I would have…
No, I’m not even… It begins with J. Her first name. And I’m not even gonna try. But Wolverine and Jean Grey, I think… Because… they, I mean, he deserves it, she needs it. Cause she’s gonna turn into a Phoenix if she doesn’t.
And their connection was palpable, tangible, you couldn’t… Every time they.. Maybe it’s because of two actors as well – it was incredible…
Baby wolverines, who can suffer..
So, anything else you wanna say? No? That was the craic about Fox vs Disney films. We talked quite a bit about specifically the X-men films, Marvel Avengers films. Which characters we liked and don’t like. The newer films – what we think will happen, our opinions on those. And who would like to settle down. So that was the craic about Fox vs Disney films.