Hello, hello, guys. Welcome back to another podcast show with Benjamin and we have Ur today, and Maria, and Varya, and we're going to be talking about a really interesting subject, which is CV's and resumes. We're also going to be talking about interviews as well. So, guys, I guess you've all had a job before your life because we're all teachers here.
So yeah, let's start with CV's. So in England, we call them "CV's". In America, you call them... What do you call them, Varya?
Well, I always called them "resumes" when I was looking for a job out of the academic world, like teaching ballet. It's not considered academic. But "a CV" was what I learned when I was in college. So...
Oh, okay. All right. So you do use the word in America.
Maybe there is a different. I guess there is a slight difference between a resume and CV, while CV should be more detailed and longer. And resume is just maybe a page.
I don't know that's the difference. I think a CV is academic from a university, meaning that you're going to show your degrees and then a resume is more like, just like a manual job or restaurant job. You're not going to really show your CV, your academic standing in a restaurant. I think that's the difference.
And also, CV stands for the Latin "curriculum vitae", which means that you write about your life in there.
Maybe there is no difference. It's, it's possible.
Yeah. No, they are interchangeable.
So what does your CV look like? Is it a long CV? What do you include on your CV? Or your résumé.
Education highlights, your past experiences, your work experiences, your hobbies, extracurricular activities or whatever.
I usually include only my education and work experience. I don't usually include what I do in my free time because it's, well, if they ask in the interview, it is another thing. But on the resume I don't put it. Maybe some skills are, like soft skills which I possess and art skills if it is related to the job.
How long should a CV or resume may be?
It's one page and not longer.
Mm hmm. That's what I would say as well. Because imagine if you were an employer and you have to sift through many different resumes, it would be quite annoying to have to read stuff. Would you include things, like "punctual", "friendly", "team player" or do you think that that's just unnecessary?
I guess it's not, not necessary to just put everything that who you are, you know, any right. Friendly personality.
And how are you going to check that the personality is really friendly?
I would have thought personally, I'm not an HR manager. I do not have experience in this field, but I would say, no.
Definitely no, I think it's very unprofessional.
Yeah, because if you're not punctual, I mean, I just don't... Yeah. So, um...
And if being punctual or friendly is your main strength... Wow, that's strange.
Well, unless you're a hostess for a restaurant when you need to be friendly. "I'm friendly. I would make a very good hostess. I'm punctual". Maybe, so. It'd be your, your highlight.
Or if you're a babysitter, you need to be punctual.
Do you think babysitters need to have, like an official CV?
What are you going to write on that? Just took care of, like five babies before. Maybe you can just put to some reference.
Yeah, maybe you work for an agency or something.
Reference would be important. When I was, I've told my story before, when I was 13, we had a like a gang of girls who went around the neighborhood changing different houses to babysit. So, you know, they knew us.
How did they apply for the jobs or how did they...
We were just a gang and everyone knew us.
They just knocked on the door and said, "Do you need my services?".
Do you have any babies to look after them?
So you just say, "Give me your baby and I will sit on it". Yeah, well, I guess nowadays we have apps for babysitters and I don't believe...
Dogsitters and catssitters.
I guess if your a dogsitter, what would your CV look like? Pictures of dogs and...
How many dogs you can have.
Then you should be friendly. Yeah, this is important there.
Yeah, it depends on the dog.
And punctual. Because those dogs have needs, so you need to be punctual.
Well, you don't wanna be too friendly of some dogs because then they will just walk all over you... Have you ever seen the TV show Cesar Millan?
Yeah. National Geographic, I guess.
Yeah. And he...,yeah. So if you're too friendly with the dog, then it's gonna..., it's gonna bite you.
Do you ever have students come to you with their CV's? Because I have a few students come to me with their CV's.
I had one. I had one. Yeah, and he asked me, "All right, how should we write it correctly? And what we include, what we should include into the CV's?".
So what are the most common mistakes that you have come? Well, Ur, you've only had one CV.
Oh, yeah, I just helped one student and it was so detailed and I advised him to just alright, reduce it a little bit, so it would be more professional, so...
Yeah, like we said before, one page, unless you work in a very, very specialist industry. But most industries I would say have one page. But when it comes to English.., Maria, have you seen any CV's in your experience as a teacher?
Of your students in general.
Yeah. Sometimes they address to me with this request.
Yeah. Well, I guess that Russian students, the most common mistake would be that they... this literal translation of some terms, for example, your degree or something, like "bakalavr", "magistr". Well, words like this that students maybe don't know how to translate.
Yeah. And also the names of Russian universities can be quite hard to translate as well.
Transliteration thing. Yeah.
Yeah. From my experience, I've seen about... I think about four CVs so far, maybe five. And the biggest mistakes are articles. So "a" and "the zero article".
What if we just avoid articles in our resume. Because it should be short and precise.
Yeah. Oh, sometimes when you include names of organizations in your CV, inevitably you have to use "a" and "the". And this is "a" and "the" seem to be pretty straightforward, but if your native language does not have articles, then it's an absolute nightmare. Does Turkish have articles?
We.., all right. We just define a quantity of it. So "a book" we call it "one book", you know.
Oh, all right. It's okay. It's defined, yeah. Yeah.
So it's kind of similars or though.
Sometimes in English "a" but it does mean "one".
But we use it in, in, that way in Turkish.
Do have this countable/uncountable thing?
So that's the biggest mistake you have going...
On a resume or CV. This is just must be lists of things. Otherwise, you're putting in a bio, a biography, and that's with full sentences and paragraphs. So there's a difference with that as well. But I'm just, I just list my things. So there are no articles.
Yeah. And another question, actually, should you write resumes in the first person? I should use the word "I".
Well, that would be a bio.
What about in, let's say, in terms of your experience when you outline your duties.
I just don't use pronouns, just verbs. "Did this", "I've done that".
So let's say you worked at... I don't know. Let's just take McDonald's, for instance. What were your duties and responsibilities? See, you wouldn't...
Took care of customers or...yeah.
Was responsible for cleaning tables.
Yeah. Response. That's a that's fair enough. Yeah.
But in the introduction part, you can, you can just present yourself, like "I", by using the pronoun, like the first person, like "I".
Or it would be a cover letter. You can use lots of pronouns.
Okay, so with a bio, if you are applying for a ballet teaching job, you're going to be telling your experiences. And so we start with the full name, and then the next time you refer to yourself, it will be "Ms. last name", and then the third time you refer to yourself as "she".
Yeah. You've mentioned cover letters. What should go in a cover letter?
I guess it will be related to the exact company you're applying for. And so you need to say why you're applying for this position in this company, what's your current experience and why this company might like you and might want you?
And what if it's like a basic role and basically your only motivation is, "I just want the money".
Well, still, you need to do some research and find out why this company is better than others. Because, well, if you want money, it's not the motivation for your, for your employer. And of course, everybody needs money. So it just, it's the same as...
Yeah, It's the same as, like, "I'm friendly and I need money". It's mmm.
So let's take...I dunno, like a car wash. So cover letter for the car wash. I'm...
I like water and car windows. I can do my job on my car.
I was driving by and I use the car wash with the best one. I would love to work here.
So it's your example, that's a kind of, yeah, man.
I was enticed by the sparkles on the cars.
So I like the color of car...
And you should have a portfolio by the way, portfolio of old cars that you washed.
Yeah, I'm excellent vacuum cleaner and...
I have used this and this brand of vacuum cleaners.
Or I like the sound. I can sleep without listening the vacuum cleaner, you know, it's... Yeah. It's a level.
They will hire you. Yeah.
Yeah. And you need to write, like how many words for that? Like 250 words.
Okay, so we're talking about resumes and CV's. But in the olden days if I wanted a job at a car wash or a ballet studio, I would just walk in and say, "Hi, do you need a ballet teacher? Yes, we do. Okay, well, let's talk". And that's how I got my job.
So much nicer. I wish you were like, yeah...
Or you walk into a restaurant or a bar, you know, I want to be a waitress, I want to be a bartender.
And they're asking for your qualifications and how you...
Well, they sat down with you right there. I never had a resume until later. So you really had to do a mass mail out and you fold it into an envelope and you send it out to a post office.
It's much harder, I would say, these days.
Especially with the remote jobs, because an employer can consider like 200 applications and oh, they all need to be with resumes.
Let's say you wanted to work at a supermarket for a brief amount of time. In the old days, you could probably just walk into the supermarket, say, "Hey, can I speak to the manager, please?".
That's what I did with my daughter. And she didn't have a resumé, but I drove her around to all the supermarkets or wherever she wanted to work. I said, "Go in, ask for the manager", and she would.
Nowadays you can't do that. Nowadays you have to go to a corporate website.
And an HR manager's e-mail address, yeah.
It's a nightmare, really. And it shouldn't be like that. It should just be like, "Hey, your criminal records? Okay, what did you do? Come on in".
Yeah, that should be simpler.
You can end up, unfortunately, having to send out at least 100 CV's before you get a decent reply.
But maybe it's the same for smaller businesses. Maybe it's the same as the old days where you can just walk in and say, "Hello". Yeah. So which businesses do you think you could just walk into and say hello?
No, I think I've tried that. I think I went into a restaurant one time and I was so desperate for a job and I went in. It was like in 2014.
Yeah. So that's pretty recent. And I... And no, all their applications were online. They really don't want you to bother them.
Yeah, well, maybe in a little tiny town, maybe you could still do that.
Yeah. I remember when I was applying for my Russian visa to become teacher at the Big Apple School. I was sitting around for, what was it, like just under three months... And I thought it would be really nice to just get, like a little quick part time job. It's so difficult to just find one like that. You can't just say, "Hey, I'm available for a few weeks. Do you need any help?".
Yeah, you can't just do that.
And what about ads? In the olden days, you had a newspaper, you looked at the ads and you circled them, and then you called them up on the phone. Yeah, a long time ago. I've done that.
So. Yeah. All right. Well, let's talk about interviews itself, so. Besides I'm working here at the Big Apple School, what were your previous interviews like?
Yeah. What were they like for you? Were they a nerve-wracking experience? Were they...?
I guess it's not very much different from a school exam or university exam. Hmm. The same level of stress.
You need to be prepared. You need to know something about what you applied for and a company that you're going to work. So it's kind of yeah.
Yeah, well, my last interview, I guess, was in Vegas, when I worked at the hotels and, like we were just saying, you have to apply to this huge Internet web of HR.
A database. And I applied for something like 70 jobs with the company, which is outrageous. And I only heard back from like one or two of them. The other one I did not want to do I did not want to be a lifeguard. I mean, it sounds fun, but it doesn't really pay much money.
And you have to save people.
Yeah, to save people. Yeah.
And what was the interview like?
So the interview itself was not really an interview, just an HR manager saying, "Hey, do you have a criminal record? Did you drug?".
Yes, yes to both questions.
Come do a drug test. And, so you have, in American companies, that are actually very strict with with drugs. I kind of understand that you don't want a crackhead working at a hotel.
For every position you will need to be tested?
In America, I think it's something really high. I can't remember how high percentage of it is, but most employers give drug tests in America.
I think, corporations, I think. I've never worked for a corporation.
Yeah, maybe small restaurants, too or maybe...
What about the teacher's position?
Oh, definitely. Yeah. You would definitely be drug tested for that.
You mean like in the public schools?
Yeah, for sure. In America, for sure. You would be. Yeah. Because I've looked at so many jobs when I was in America and yeah, all of them say yeah, "drug test prior to employment". Who cares... Unless you, unless you're under methamphetamine, I mean.
Yeah I wouldn't care. I wouldn't.
Yes, you have to go and give a urine sample and then wait for a few days nervously.
Maybe they'll find out that if you're pregnant or something.
Or if you eat a poppy seed bagel. So do you know poppy seeds? Yeah. So if you eat poppy seed bagel, you could turn out positive for heroin.
Yeah, I know that from a Jerry Seinfeld episode.
Oh, yeah. I saw it. Yeah, I can't remember it, but I know that.
Elaine was trying to get a job and she kept on those poppy seeds.
Is it really a thing or is it just a myth? I mean, you see, how many bagels should you eat to test positive?
Poppy seeds are the main ingredient in heroin.
And in opium, you know? Yeah.
And opium. Yeah. So you're going to test positive for opiates.
But there's a whole industry. It's really funny as a whole industry in America, based around helping people get jobs and passing drug tests. It's really funny because if you go to a lots of just corner shops in America or at least in Las Vegas, you can see fake urine packs.
You're paying someone and they give you the healthy, and...
Yeah. So you can, yeah, pass a drug test.
Get for clear urine. Yeah.
And it's so funny. Like I saw a YouTube video about it and you have such a, such a tricky thing to do, so you need to..before your drug test for the job interview, you need to go to a gas station, find a microwave, and heat up the fake urine.
Only the urine pack, it has like a special dial that says how hot it is. And of course, it has to be body temperature because these drug test providers, they make sure that it's a body temperature when they receive the sample. And then you..., and then if it's not a job related to the Department of Transport. So if you're not doing a job that's related to driving trucks or stuff like that, then no one's going to watch you go to the bathroom. But if it's a D.O.T. Department of Transport job, people watch you go to the bathroom. And this is...
They're more interested in this than in your hard skills, soft skills, what's so ever, yeah?
Well, a lot of corporate jobs in America - yes. But to be fair, like if you're a truck driver, if you're a truck company, you don't want some drug addict.
No, they don't mind you at all, because they will overwork you and they want you to drive all through the night 4872 hours.
I mean, it depends on the drug. If you're talking about...
Whatever over-the-counter drugs are, I don't know. But truck drivers are drug addicts, yeah, because they have to keep their eyes open.
They have hair tests and they have urine tests. They're really strict in America about maybe in the old days, I don't know. But nowadays they're really strict about that.
I mean, of course it has to be strict. Nobody wants a drug addict. But I just didn't think that it is a big problem because here in Russia... Well, it's not.
If the company wants their things delivered on time or early, they'll want someone who can drive through the night, through the day, through the whole week, whatever. And they don't care how you do it. Just do it.
But I don't think they allow the exotics. They can allow just for the hash or whatever. Like simple drugs maybe.
Oh, yeah. No, it's everything. They don't allow anything. Yeah.
If you want to be a truck driver, they're very strict now. I mean, you can drink alcohol, but you have it's like they're very, very strict about it.
Okay, maybe, maybe to get the job just for the laws for that maybe.
For the Department of Transport, I was reading they do, they do stock checks of random people.
But these big 18 wheelers. Are you talking about that kind of truck drivers?
No, all truck drivers, all truck drivers, yeah. I was looking at, I would just casually be a truck driver. It'd be quite fun. And that's the first thing you see when you apply for a job on these trucking websites is yeah, the drug test requirements, and, yeah, they're very strict about it. Anyway, enough about...
What? Driving a truck across America? I would love to do it. It would be so cool.
I mean, it could be fun to drive your own car, but how is it fun to be a truck driver?
I mean, maybe after a year of it would be pretty boring. But with at least the first year, if you drive on the West Coast, that would be amazing.
Yeah, but I mean it's work. You're responsible for the load that you are carrying and everything.
Yeah, but you can listen to podcasts, like the Big Apple School podcast and you can, yeah, see beautiful sceneries.
I mean, but you could rent a car and go on holiday...
You get paid for and you get really good money for it as well.
Well. Yeah. They're earning a lot.
In America truck drivers now, they get paid up to 70,000, $80,000.
Okay. That's the primary motivation.
But of course, you have to stay awake for long hours. And some quite often you have to sleep in the truck itself and...
And you have to stop at gas station showers and...
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, It'd be quite interesting becoming a truck driver, but they have very stringent requirements.
It's interesting how from job interviews we debated to this.
Yeah, anyway. Yeah. Coming back to job interviews. So you've tried to look for jobs at a restaurant. What other places have we tried to look at? Look for jobs at?
I had an interview when I was a student, I guess, for a job in a bookshop. And then only, I guess, teaching positions after this, yeah, several times.
Oh, did you look for one?
Yeah, it is my first job after graduation. So I worked as a translator for four years and half from Turkish - to English, from English - to Turkish.
Oh, cool. And what was the interview like for that? Did they give you, like a practice?
Yeah, I remember they gave me a text. All right, so you need to just translate this text to Turkish within 10 minutes. It was like a full page of text, so. Right. One, two, three, go. And after that, I just wrote down the Turkish.
And was this like a translation house, like an organization which specializes, or is it..?
No, I applied one of those kind of, like corporations.
Yes, that was kind of a hard thing to get there. But I was working with a company, like a corporate company. Their internal and external affairs department, which I was dealing with the translations and everything, all the legal writings, and all the correspondence. So I was dealing with that one.
Yeah. Oh, I have a question, because you were in the Marines, weren't you, before? Tell me about that job interview process.
That was a huge process. Yeah. I'm being a ballet dancer, so I had to learn how to run. And so instead of, you know, on stage, you run leading with your toes. But in running, you lead with your heels, you know. So I kind of ran on the balls of my feet, but I had to learn how to run and I had to get a lot of age exams, exemptions.
So what did you do? Did you just go to a recruitment office?
Yeah, and there's so glad to... Because they get credit if they recruit you. So of course, they're on your side. They want. You have to take, like a not an S.A.T. test, but some kind of exam of how... The scores are really low for the Marine Corps. Really low, like, like passing, like 36 or something.
You could just be a potato.
Yeah, physical fitness. And you have to have recommendation letters from a priest or something.
Also like an approved profession or has to write a recommendation letter.
So I just knocked on a Catholic church. I said, "Hi, hello, Father. I need a recommendation because I'm applying for the Marine Corps. You don't know me, but would you write one?". And he kind of, like mmm. And then he sat down and wrote it.
So did you go through all that?
I did. I went to every...
Trainings and, like the whole week, and everything. Like, you don't eat, you don't sleep.
But, of course, we had about 12 weeks of training. Yeah, but to get in. Yeah, that was a big process. Like three months to get in.
Yeah. So it's a way I'm more interested in the whole process. At what point can they kick people off the course?
Want you get in and you're in boot camp?
Oh, if you do not pass some exams, like the obstacle course, or the life for a life, or rappelling, if you don't pass those, then you're out.
Did a lot of people get kicked out?
Maybe a few, but I was so afraid to get kicked out. I made sure that I repelled, and I jumped off, and I did everything that was required of me.
Yeah, very scary. But you have to do if you don't want to be kicked out.
Yeah. Be quiet. Personally, I was quite, like to be in the military. After school I was looking at joining the Army, but, unfortunately, I had a medical problem, so I couldn't do it. But the interview process is very, very stringent, like they don't accept any crap on your background. You have to have like a...
Like drugs. Yeah, definitely, you have to have a drug test.
I mean, it's definitely not everyone's cup of tea joining the armed forces.
And also some companies, I mean not the Army, I don't know anything about this, but some companies have interviews on several levels, several stages. For example, firstly you talk to an HR Manager, then you talk to maybe the head of the department, then to the general manager of the company and, yeah.
And then you get your position of a car washer.
So, Ur, you said your last job was, this not you're not talking about the translation?
No. And after the translation, I worked, as like an export sales representative. Then I worked, like internal production facility management team. I was in the team. And my last job was on field operations manager. So I was working in a hospital chain of Turkey, one of the biggest one.
And what was it like a scary interview for these places?
Actually, it's like Maria said, it was like a three step, kind of interview process. So first I had to talk with an HR person, she was a manager, apparently. Then I had to have the interview with the HR manager, then the CEO. So that was kind of a nerve-wracking, but the last step was kind of...They are out of the box thing kind of, so it happened, so kind of suddenly, and they asked me to come over. All right, we are going to have a kind of nice dinner. I didn't know that I was going to be interviewed.
It was kind of an acceptance, kind of speech plus the last interview. So it was kind of a nice dinner. And they asked me a couple of questions, like the casual questions, and they said, "All right, congratulations".
Did they ask you personal questions, like..?
Personal plus, like hard skills as well. So, all right. They gave you, like a scenario. And how would you, just act in terms of...
That's so funny. Like, what do you think of those questions?
I don't like those questions.
I think that's so annoying.
Sorry, which questions again?
So, let's say, like those "role-play questions" in interviews, what do you think?
"If you have a chance to do this, this, this? What would you do or how would you react in a way kind of so..?".
And you have to think of what they want to hear.
Exactly. So you need to give them what they want in a way. So, "Mmm, let me think". Yeah, it's kind of...
I guess it depends on the position because as a teacher, I find questions, like, okay.
DPA, teaching jobs. You can say that. All right, though...
Yeah. I mean, like, if you do a trial lesson, for instance, on Zoom, that's different. That's different. That's not like... that's a trial lesson, that's different to, for instance, "What would you do if you're working in a hotel?".
They can ask you, like, "What would you do if, let's say, I don't know if an angry parent intrude your lesson with a teenager?", whatever, and, well, you should be able to imagine...
Or how would you react to a kindergarten student who is disobedient and doesn't listen to what you're doing in a lesson...
Or who bursts into tears in the middle of the class.
So that's all right. So teaching is all right. That questions work. But in a corporate life...
It also depends like what questions of is. For example, "Imagine that you are a butterfly". Mmm. Maybe I don't want to.
All right. The question was, like, "Think about yourself in five years time, you're going to just run this company or run this chain of hospitals. What would be the first thing that you change?". Oh, come on, man. All right. I don't know.
Yeah, yeah, that's the thing. So you can say it, you know? So that's kind of...
I guess. Maybe they want to know if they're gonna be fired by you.
I remember I applied for this big corporation right out of university, and they have one of these... It was not just three step, it was, like a five step interview process. And the first means everyone came to the interview. It was, like a conference center and everyone came with their suits, and they gave us these ridiculous team building exercises. They said, like...
Pretend off the board and just explain...
Pretend you're going to the moon, and you have, like a special spaceship. Like, what are you going to bring with you on the spaceship? And I just felt, like, a sandwich.
Sorry. What position was it?
It was... I can't remember what it was. It was, I think, something like business development manager, something like that. Something boring.
Yeah. Yeah, most of the corporate.
Yeah, maybe it was something to do, like languages and but it wasn't anything like really interesting.
Some kind of managerial position, yeah?
Well, maybe not managerial, but some sales.
You were not going to send people to the moon.
Oh, they had a question, you know, "the hot air balloon debates"? Do you know what that is?
Kick someone out of the hot air balloon.
They have send boxes for this, don't they? So they can...
A raft. It could be a raft as well.
So they said, "Choose celebrities and then get in the hot air balloon". But not actually, you know what I mean? And and you have to debate each other.
And discuss the problem that you need to solve in a way.
Yeah. And everyone's choice was silly because I was quite proud of my choice. I chose what was it, Ray Mears, you know, the survivalist expert. And who's going to debate with the survivalist expert? Of course...
So everyone said or Kanye West, or whatever, like who needs Kanye West on a hot air balloon when you need Ray Mears, when you need to know how to survive in the wild? Yeah. If you ever have a hot air balloon debate in your interview, choose a survivalist expert. You're gonna...Yeah, you're gonna come out well. All right, so interviews. What should we wear to our interviews?
Smart, casual. How would you define smart, casual?
Short jacket without a tie and I don't know. But in the second or third step, you have to wear at some point. So, all right. It's going to be an introduction to the board members. So you can just wear a tie.
Oh, yeah, definitely, like a corporate and...Yeah, for sure.
It depends on the position.
I mean, it could be just ridiculous if you wear a tie and maybe a black and white for the position of...
Waiter, car washer, yeah, well...
Not this again. Not problems with car washers.
Do you have to clean cars?
Just the position doesn't involve any sort of this uniform, dress code. That's another dress code.
So. Well, yeah, if you dressed up for a car washing position, it would look like you're overqualified for this job. And they probably wouldn't hire you.
Think about you're trying to just wash the car with tuxedo. It's a bow tie.
Evening dress, high heels.
That's interesting that you mentioned overqualified because some people who do get degrees and some of it could be overqualified, and can find it hard to get a job in the first place.
Yeah, it can be a problem.
Yeah. I guess it depends on the degree you do and how much need it is. So, yeah.
Yeah. Speaking of clothes, I would say that as long as it is neat and not smelly, it's fine.
Well, unless you need to clean a sewer, then...
Yeah. Bring the smells. Yeah. How should you sit in a job interview? I'm looking at you, Varya, because you have a very good posture. How should you sit in a job interview?
Well, if I were auditioning for a secretarial job, then I would have to hunch over a laptop, I would have to curve my back.
Just to show your dedication.
Yeah, this shows that I've been doing this for years.
Yeah. So anyway, what kind of difficult questions could you come across? We already talked about some of the new role play missions. "Tell me about yourself". How should you answer that questions?
Briefly? Like in a couple of sentences, two or three sentences, I guess, that's enough. Nobody wants to hear a life story, broken heart and everything.
Yeah. What other questions could be come across?
Tell me about your previous work experience and why you quit your previous job, which can be a tricky one, because you are not supposed to tell anything bad about your previous employer, because they can understand that you are not the right candidate for them.
And why is it bad? I mean, I know it's bad, but why? Why would you say it's bad to bad mouth your previous employer?
It means that you are not a responsible person and you have a bad mouth and well, you are maybe not a nice person to be around.
And what if, I don't know, let's say if a colleague murdered someone.., let's say if something really bad happened, you know, "Oh, I love my previous team, but...".
There was a psycho in my team.
It depends. If the information is not classified, then...
Non-disclosure agreement and you have that one. You can say that's the thing if you're working in a company.
Because they already may have known about that and they will be expecting you to tell them about it, because they already had done the research.
Yeah. I mean, for example...
It actually happened to my daughter.
Yes, she was working at an insurance, a very small insurance office, and the owner was high on cocaine, and he mistreated her. And she would say things like, you know, "You can't treat me like this!". And, but she kept on working really hard. And then finally she decided to quit. And after she quit, the cocaine addict was murdered by his girlfriend.
Yes. And it was, like an episode on crime, you know, these crime shows? Yeah, it happened in Atlanta, Georgia.
Insane. So what could your daughter have said to her? To the next employer?
Probably nothing. I think that's something you don't want to say anything about.
The company went bankrupt.
Yes, yes, yes. Downsized.
So you never badmouthed your employer. Well, maybe if your next employer knows previously.
And they want to hear bad things.
They mostly do the research, as you said. So they already know about it. What happened to you and why did you just leave.
Yeah. Another question. When getting a job interview, let's say, if you're a job-hopper. If everyone knows what I mean by job-hopper? Someone who...
Changes jobs frequently. Exactly.
Yeah, grasshopper. How should you explain that? Let's say, if you've changed jobs every six months to a year and you have five changes on your CV, how could you explain that?
It also depends which jobs. For example, if you jump from a car washer to McDonald's waiter, to a postman, to a truck driver...
It's maybe strange, like I'm in the middle of understanding myself.
But if it is like a teaching position in one school, then another school...Well, it also can be... It can depend. Maybe you moved from one city to another city.
One country to another country.
Well, I know some industries. It's normal to change a lot, like IT professionals. I've heard that they change every year or so.
Or you can simply explain that, right. My personal ambitions don't meet with your company's profile, so I decided to quit. Maybe you can say if they need an answer.
I have been looking for the company, like yours.
Yes, it's more political, you know? Yeah.
Politically correct. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Um. Oh, another thing. Do you think it's important for candidates to ask questions in interviews? So you know how at the end of some interviews, they say, "Have you got any questions for me?".
I think it is important because you show that you are interested, that you are curious, and that you know at least something. And, well, maybe it's not like your first question should be, "What is my salary going to be?".
Yeah. Talk about money is dirty. You're supposed to wait until later.
Well, it's okay to ask about money, but maybe not...
Not on the first place, yeah.
What if they've answered your questions in the interview and then they comes to the point where says, "Oh, question time".
No, I'll be honest and say, "Oh, I think you've answered everything. I think this is a very nice company. And, you know, hope that you pick me".
And what questions, ideally, could you ask? Well, let's just think of.
Yeah, let's do a little role play. We've already done the car wash before. It's on the car wash. Let's think something different. Let's do. Restaurant manager.
The Workload weekly... You can ask for your weekly workload and your responsibilities.
And you could ask about your career path.
Like how you can grow if you can...
In a dance studio, it's very simple. You go in and they'll say, "We need..." They'll ask, "What evenings can you teach? I can. I'm available on Tuesday and Thursday". And they'll say, "Oh, okay, we need someone to teach from 4 to 8. Can you do it? Yeah, I'll take that job". So I'm going to teach there on Thursdays and then I go to another studio, and they'll say, "When are you available?". And this is when I'm available. So, you know, your hours, your work, and then what's nice about being a ballet teacher. At the end, the director says, "Well, what is your fee?". Because each teacher has her own fee. So then I tell them how much I charge and they could possibly say, "Oh, okay, that's fine" or "Oh, that's a little high", or, you know, "Is it negotiable?". And sometimes before the Great Recession of 2008, no, my fee was not negotiable and I would just walk out, "Okay, well, maybe some other time" and I'd walk out. I would get my pay.
And what was the contract? Was it self-employed or was it...
Oh, yeah, what we call it, what is that "independent contractor". Yeah.
Yeah, independent condactor. In England, we have a term called "zero hours contracts" and they are quite controversial because some people don't like them because they don't provide benefits. That being a normal employee would provide.
Like a social security or...
Yeah, exactly. But they do provide a lot of flexibility. So let's say if you are a delivery driver, it means that you can work as many or as few hours, as you like. But you're you're self-employed and you don't get sick benefits or anything like that.
Zero hours contracts. Yeah, I think maybe it's an English term. I don't know if it's an American term as well, but...
Freelance you can also use. Freelance contract or you can say, yeah.
But you still need to pay taxes, right?
Of course you have to pay taxes. Yeah. And at least, the last time I was in England, it was something like £12,500. If you earn above that threshold, then you have to pay taxes. Yeah. Whereas what is it in Russia? The tax threshold. Would you pay tax on every income source?
Yeah, but I'm bad with numbers.
I think in the States, the minimum was 500. If you had a part time job that actually you only made 600 that whole year on that particular job, you wouldn't have to.
Well, it's Russia. It's the employer's.
Well, also, in America, it depends on the states as well.
So Nevada, where I work, they had a zero income tax, which was amazing. But of course you still have to pay federal income tax as well. America is really complicated for tax.
That's a whole other subject anyway. So we spoke about questions we can ask.
The restaurant manager. We were talking. Yeah. So what would you ask as a restaurant manager position?
To seem eager. Maybe ask questions about the brand itself, perhaps.
Your customer portfolio. Maybe the profiles.
Yeah. Yeah, the typical customer. And what is your typical customer like? Do I need to know their names?
Names or their high profile, or regulars or whatever.
Yeah, that could definitely show interest in a way that's not detrimental to your application.
Some innovations they go into to introduce.
So what are some red flags to look out for with employee, with employers?
Yeah, I think hours. Because I'm big on choosing my own time and my own hours. And, so a red flag is if they don't allow you to see the contract after you've gone through a lot of process. Part of the process, yeah. That's a red flag.
Anything out of contract might be a red flag. So if it's written on the contract, all right, both parties should follow that and strictly as possible.
But you only get to know it after you signed the contract. During the job interview, it's hard to say. I mean, a red flag could be that the person is just not likable. And maybe all people who you have seen look miserable and unhappy, and it's like, okay, maybe this is not the company I want to work for.
Well, before you sign the contract, you're going to agree on the hours and the pay. And then if there's something in the contract that shows that you can be put, there could be other duties placed upon you, and you didn't know about that then it's almost too late. So there's everything should be in the contract. You should be able to see what that contract is, what you're entering.
What else? Obviously, if the boss smells bad.
So we're speaking about in the job interview or...after...
I would say in the job interview.
Yeah, because it's different. Because...
You're not supposed to read the contract in the job interview because they haven't decided yet. They're going to...
Or you can ask for a draft for the job.
Or at the end of the process because sometimes there is a process and near the end of this end phase, you should be able to view, what's on the contract.
Yeah, I agree. So what would you say if the employer said, "Oh, we are like family. We work very hard".
Some share from your family...
Work hard, play hard. What does that mean to you?
And party hard after that. Yeah. All right. Hard work pays off, so you can, you can do whatever you want after you put everything under the person that you need to.
It doesn't describe me. Work hard, play hard. Yeah, it doesn't describe me.
Do you want to get drunk with colleagues?
Hopefully not a good idea. Maybe not a good idea.
It happened several times.
I mean, it can be an okay thing.
Yeah, as long as you know. As long as you have nothing to hide. Yeah.
Oh, yeah. I'm open without alcohol. Imagine the alcohol. I would tell everything.
All right. Well, I guess we talked about interviews itself. Um, yeah, so let's, let's talk about quitting jobs. So the opposite. So interview. Have you ever had an exit interview? Maybe or maybe you've had exit interviews.
It wasn't a formal one. It was again when I decided, "all right, guys, I can't do it anymore, I'm just quitting the corporate world and I need to just do something else that I feel myself happy, like and personally like, spiritual and not economic".
And they invited me again and another dinner, so and then they asked me, like...
You'd love given the dinner at this company.
So that was kind of yeah, "So alright, let's have a dinner together and let's chat". So we can drink and after that we can just enjoy ourselves.
But that means that they valued you. They didn't want you to leave.
Yeah, that was the thing. So they didn't want me to leave. All right, I was a kind of a functioning manager that they want me to do whatever I was doing, but I was so kind of fed up with my life, like, five years...
Did they allow you to give them feedback in this exit interview? Because that would be helpful.
Yeah, I said couple of things that they didn't like that much, but that wasn't like, like... I was polite.
Oh, I think we should have, like an air of grievances, you know.
That wouldn't be... I said, all right, if we didn't do this things, I wouldn't decide to do this that in this way, you know. So I gave them a couple of clues what they should do in the next for the next manager that they're going to hire.
It was tricky because if you rely on a previous employee for reference...
But you're changing careers anyway, so you didn't really need there.
But I already decided that I was not going to work in a corporate life, so I was kind of relaxed. All right, so I'm, I'm going to be a teacher. I'm going to just tour around the world or whatever. So I was kind of relaxed. Okay, I can say anything I want. I wasn't, I wasn't rude.
The role is to be professional. There's no need. Yeah. And otherwise.
And at the end of it we just shook hands and they said, "All right, so good luck for the rest". And I said, "All right, just good luck, bye bye". That's it.
Befor coming here to the Big Apple School, I found a job for three months with this guy. I really liked him. He's a cool guy. He gave me a job as a business development manager. But, to be honest with you, I actually let me give you some more background story. I was working in a hotel when COVID came...
When you were back in Las.
In Vegas, in Las Vegas. And then I found a job with this guy who setting up a financial... He's a financial advisor. He was a very fun guy, a cool guy. And I worked with him for three months. But then I thought, I was thinking, well, before joining him, I want to go to Russia. I want to, you know, I want to teach English and improve my Russian. And I didn't hear back from a few employers, because in Russia they had the COVID situation and...
Yeah, but then I heard back from the Big Apple School and I thought, you know what, I'd much rather be here and be an English teacher than continue in this job. But I found it so hard to quit this jobe. I like this guy so much, and he, like, gave me a lot of of energy, and yeah, I just felt so bad and I had to, like, give him my letter, my, my notice...
No, I didn't cry. But I was just like, I like this guy.
Yeah, I felt bad, because he put time and resources into me, and I just felt terrible.
Did he try to make you feel guilty?
No, no. He didn't. He was a good guy. That's what made it even... Yeah, that's what made it sting.
But some bosses do let something like that.
Well, he was nice man and everything, so he did it for you.
Yeah. But the thing was, is that before I had before I joined him, I wanted to become an English teacher, but I needed to find a job to carry me over. And I just felt bad.
Yeah, that's. I felt the same thing, but I wasn't like that all right, "Oh, my God. What I'm going to do". So I already finished that episode of my life. On my mind. So I already decided.
Seven and total eight years in, like, in corporate life lifestyle. All right, all right. That's enough is enough. Yeah, I'm just. Oh, that was kind of. Yeah, I felt like that. Yeah, that kind of bitterness.
So, yeah. What was the notice period in your job? Was it two weeks?
15 days. Yes. Basis two weeks.
Yeah. Is that like Turkish law or is that just a company by company thing?
Most of the companies are looking at that period before an employee just quit the job, like a maximum one and a half or two weeks. So... But some companies ask for a month priority or...
In the ballet world, they'll ask you at the end of spring, "What are your plans for next fall? Are you going to continue?". And that's usually when you say, "I'm going to move on" or "No, I want to come back".
Like at the end of the season.
Yeah, yeah. So like, well, they really start making their schedules in March or April for August, September, they want to know.
I guess that is the same about schools. If the school doesn't work in the summer then they might ask you.
At the end of June or May.
Before you go on vacation.
You want to renew your contract. Yeah, Ur, it's different in all countries because you worked in Vietnam for a while. What was the contract like that? Was it like each year you have to renew.
It always had to resign it.
But some things were kind of negotiable. Some things weren't, so, okay, that... There was a certain raise on your bonuses and your extra benefits, but your base salary remained the same. But you had your kind of an extra hours pay with an increased pay or whatever. So I had to sign in every year, like I signed five contracts with them. Yeah.
Yeah. I've never had to resign. Well, sometimes, but I have only few times I've had to resign. But when I worked, I worked in two hotels. The first hotel was just sign the contract and it's valid until...
Yeah, exactly. I'm happy you said the word "termination". So what are the different words we can say to quit your job? To terminate a contract. But to quit your job.
Just "resign". "Please accept my resignation" is a normal thing to say.
Please accept my resignation.
Like, if you're writing out your resignation, please accept this.
And what about "to fire"? What are the synonyms we can use "to fire an employee"?
Phrasal verb "to let someone go".
You said "to terminate". You can terminate an employee.
"To terminate" is a strong word. Yeah, yeah. It's not a nice word.
It's very official language.
Yes, yes. I would not want to be terminated, like amputations.
You can say also "expiry of your contracts".
If you don't resign, it expires.
Oh, yeah, that's nice. And that's up to you, right.
Another formal term would be "to dismiss an employee".
Oh, yeah. And dismissed, sounds like you be misbehaved. That's what that sounds to me.
Yes, you're dismissed because of your bad behavior.
Yes. But it's quite nice, that terminate is very Arnold Schwarzenegger.
You're being terminated. Get out of my company.
And some more slang ways of saying to be fired would be "to get sacked". Exactly. "To sack someone" or "to be sacked" if you're the employee. Yeah, I've heard "to give someone or to give an employee the boot". I can say that as well. I mean, maybe it's a bit old. I don't.
Yeah, it's old, but yeah...
Yeah. To give someone the boot.
Yeah. So quit, resign... And then of course, we have, for instance, in the COVID pandemic, he might have been a good employee, the company. What does the company do to you then?
Oh, yeah. So, like downsizing.
Means that we have to let some people go.
Yeah. To let someone go or to lay off.
Lay off. Right, that's nice.
Yeah, suspend your contract.
It's still not very nice. You would not want to be suspended.
Yeah, well, suspended is more, well, I guess, it is kind of.. Can you be laid off and be suspended?
I don't know. Laid off sounds so nice.
Laid off means that like they terminated your contract.
Like they can help it. We have to lay off some and you're you get the... Oh, what's kind of like so yeah, the cut, you know, like, get your throat cut.
When I was working in Vegas and they laid off the employees due to the COVID pandemic, it was really confusing because I started working for this other guy and I thought, "Oh, they laid you off. That's done". But then I got a phone call, like a few months later saying, "Hey, come back to work". And I said, "Oh, I'm so sorry. I've found a new employer. I... Yeah, I thought...". And he said, "No, no, no, you have to come back and you have to formally terminate your contract". But I thought if you were laid off, it would be naturally terminated and obviously you...
Had to sign couple of papers and everything and yes.
Yeah, it wasn't too difficult cause it was a big company and the boss was a nice guy, too. Yeah, it was kind of strange because they sent all these letters out to people saying, "Unfortunately, you have been laid off" and..
We expect you to sit there and twiddle your thumbs, and wait for us to call you back.
Yeah. Yeah. What I didn't like was it was on call. On call meaning that you can be called at any time of day or night and that just. No, can't do that. Yeah. I had to give back my parking pass. Well, fair enough, because...
Yeah, yeah. I started give that back and they wanted me to give back my company badge.
Well, you had a lot of benefits and that's cool.
It is a cool place. I really liked it. It was Caesars Entertainment. A great place to work actually. And they have good benefits and you can get cheaper tower rooms, and the different resorts. But, to be honest, I'd much prefer being an English teacher. So, yeah. All right, guys. Well, let us know if you've quit your job before. And yeah, let us know if you have questions about CV's or if you wanna have a CV - talk. If you want to come to us and we can, yeah, have a lesson with you, and we can look at your CV's and provide all sorts of corrections to it. And also, guys, check out our stickers if you follow us on Telegram. So we have some funny, ridiculous stickers of us, teachers. Definitely recommend you download that sticker pack. And also we have published quite a few videos here at the Big Apple School of me and of other teachers. Definitely check those out. And yeah, also check out our website which is www.BigAppleSchool.com where you can read articles, listen to more podcasts and yeah, find out more information about the courses we offer here. So that's it for today, guys. Thank you very much.
Thank you. See you next time.
Мария Усаченко
